The transgender dilemma

On April 24, all-American sporting superstar Bruce Jenner, who won gold for the decathlon in Montreal in 1972, announced that he was transsexual and that for all intents and purposes, “I’m a woman”.

This week, she revealed that her new name was Caitlyn. The shock was seismic: Jenner is not only a sporting hero but also features in the reality TV series Keeping up with the Kardashians, as until recently she was married to Kris and stepfather to her children.

What really perplexed evangelicals however, was that she was both a Christian and a Republican – neither of which really seemed to fit with her new identity. She said in her interview with Diane Sawyer: “I would sit in church and always wonder, ‘In God’s eyes, how does he see me?'”

Jenner’s revelations made headlines because of who she is. But there are more and more people, and not just in the US, who identify themselves as transsexuals – generally used for people who transition from one sex to another – or transgendered, whose sense of their gender differs from their physical sex. In a sign of how what was once rare is now becoming mainstream.

For some Christians, helping people to transition from one gender to another is a compassionate response to a deeply-felt need. Others are profoundly uncomfortable about the theological implications of such interventions. So what are the issues, and how should Christians approach them?

Treatments for the condition span the full range from counselling to full-scale gender reassignment surgery. People who don’t choose that or aren’t suitable candidates might have speech therapy, hair removal or hormone therapy. If they do want to make a full transition they’d be expected to live in their chosen gender identity for at least a year beforehand. The rigorous process of assessment generally seems to ‘work’: according to the NHS, after surgery most transsexuals are happy with their new sex and feel comfortable with their gender identity. One review of studies carried out over a 20-year period found that 96 per cent of people who had gender reassignment surgery were satisfied (though a 2011 Swedish survey found “considerably higher risks for mortality, suicidal behaviour, and psychiatric morbidity than the general population”).

However, many evangelical Christians have serious theological doubts about the procedures, and about the increasing normalisation of the ‘transgendered’ identity.

http://www.christiantoday.com/article/transgender.and.christian.how.caitlyn.jenner.challenges.the.church/55334.htm

Advertisements

72 thoughts on “The transgender dilemma

  1. Some Christians I think, have some genuine concerns andconflict when it comes to the LGBT. Transgender ism does I think, throw what most conservative Christians’ view of gender out of whack.

    There is research that suggests that brain structure and cognitive function, as well as environmental factors determine gender identity. From what I’ve read, most children have a sense of their own gender identity by primary school (about 5).

    While I do sympathise with people who have conflicting thoughts and feelings about the LGBT+, I’ve got to say, I can’t stand wilful ignorance and insensitive comments, I was reading a blog post yesterday (not a WP one), and I lost if with one of the commenters. I wasn’t rude, (tried not to be), but I was blunt about how I thought the comment that I was addressing was ignorant and had big implications. I try not to get emotional about things like that, but it just hits me, maybes because of who I am and what i admit I’ve struggled with in the past.

    What both conservatives and liberals need to understand is that these are people. Their struggles are not there to be mocked, ignored or scoffed at. In terms of theological issues, what people need to keep in minx is the Golden Rule AND an understanding of the struggle that many LGBT go through and at least an open mind to understanding the science, not pseudo science – of these topics.

    Like

      • “There is research that suggests that brain structure and cognitive function, as well as environmental factors determine gender identity. From what I’ve read, most children have a sense of their own gender identity by primary school (about 5).”

        Really Sarah and Bryan? Someone who has a pair of testicles and a penis is not necessarily male? Someone who has a vagina is not a female? And what about Alfred Kinsey’s claims that just because some hetero male has had a fleeting consideration of homosexual sex, it makes all males homosexuals?

        And what about my three year old neighbour kid who believes he’s Bugs Bunny, that does mean he’s a rabbit, or he will screw like a rabbit when he grows older just because he identifies with a cartoon character?

        Does common sense have to be thrown out the window?

        Like

      • Three paragraphs of complete and utter balderdash and then you complain about lack of common sense.

        The irony is incredible.

        Like

      • Bryan,
        It is recognised that babies born with both sets of genitals are freaks of nature; not normal. This does not mean we should treat them with contempt, but with pity and compassion.

        But not all transgenders are born with two sets of genitals. Jenner/Caitlyn was not one of these. In fact it had to spend a considerable amount of surgery to become a “woman”.

        To support gender bending, you changed the goal post. You did not write your blog surrounding the unfortunates who are born with two types of genitals.

        You wrote the blog surrounding a male who had expensive surgery to become a woman, praising such actions and insulting evangelicals who have a problem with this.

        Which puts your liberal brand of Christianity in the following conundrums:

        1) Jesus came to save us from our sins, by curing us from our sins. Might not Jesus be able to cure people like Jenner from wanting to become a woman? In spite of those scientific studies that tell us that a child’s sexual identity is confirmed by the age of 5?

        2) Both the Old Testament and the New Testament condemn effeminacy? Did God make a stuff up when He inspired His prophets to condemn such practices as sin? As a professed Christian, what say you?

        3) If your name was Jenner and it is natural for your brain to tell you that you’re a man trapped inside a woman’s body and vice-versa, why is it not natural for my brain to tell me that gender benders are a freak of nature, an abomination? Who is the final arbiter as to who is correct? God maybe (if you claim to be a Christian)?

        4) Scientific literature also tells us that a sweet tooth in a child is a genetic marker for alcoholism and drunkenness later in life. Yet the Bible condemns drunkenness. Are we to discard the Bible’s teaching on drunkenness because of genetic predisposition, and extremely strong desire to drink? As a Christian, what say you?

        Truly common sense has gone out the window in the liberal Christian theology.

        Like

      • Davinci,
        You have the VERY bad habit of putting words into the mouths of others and misrepresenting people.

        You wrote the blog surrounding a male who had expensive surgery to become a woman, praising such actions and insulting evangelicals who have a problem with this.

        No I didn’t “praise” such actions and neither did I “insult” evangelicals who had a problem with transgenderism. I would expect you to apologise for that misrepresentation. Or at least acknowledge it.

        What I did say – and you ignored – it’s difficult to look at the grey areas if we are black and white about this issue. Frankly, I don’t know what’s wrong or right here and I would like to see more evidence. Not just the politics of it.

        Who is the final arbiter as to who is correct? God? Yes. Not me and certainly not you.

        Like

      • “I would expect you to apologise for that misrepresentation. Or at least acknowledge it.”

        I expect you’re not holding your breath on either count Bryan.

        Like

  2. Good article Bryan and I enjoyed the response by Sara.

    I do not agree with gay marriage by the way.

    But I know the gay community does cop it at times as does the Christian community.

    There is a very high rate of depression and suicide in the gay community.
    Not enough has gone into that as to why and for healing to occur.
    I know some like to think that gay marriage will help.
    It will do nothing as depression is deep and often a combination of many factors.

    I have issues with the grow transgenderism and the increasing labels such as mx, gender neutral etc.

    In some schools in the states we have boys who “feel” female being allowed in female change rooms. Even though the majority of these girls feel highly uncomfortable in the name of “equality” this has to happen apparently. Not to mention those that would use this for their own perverse actions. I would like to see more science as Sara mentions.

    Being gay is not so concrete as people think or that the gay community would believe.
    I know of several people who once being gay realised they were not. Now heterosexual and cannot believe the actions they partook in once.

    In the west being gay is far more of an identity that in other places. For example in Saudi Arabia with extreme control over girls and boys mixing in public, the males in big cities will get together to have sex. These men do not see themselves as gay. They are just involved in a sexual action.

    Some see it as a phase and many will go on to get married when they can.

    So we are far from fully understanding what being gay is? who really is gay? Is it your identity? Is it genetic?(for now it is not as far as we know) and what specific therapies do gay people require to help deal with depression and suicide.

    Once we get past the you are a bigot and other abusive comments from both sides we may just get somewhere with all this.

    Like

    • It is brave of us to discuss this topic though in a social justice way. I think we deserve medals for confronting the all pressing inclusiveness topics.

      Like

      • off topic but should the Nobel Prize be the Gun Powder Legacy?

        Like

      • Transgender does not mean gay. Transgender is about gender identity and gender expression where as gay, lesbian, bisexual, and heterosexual/straight is about sexual orientation, which is emotional and physical attraction to others.
        While transgender people are sometimes assumed to be gay or lesbian
        based on stereotypes about gay men and lesbians, the terms are not
        interchangeable. Transgender people also have a sexual orientation,
        just as everyone else in society.

        Liked by 1 person

    • Thanks Alexie/
      I think the issue of transgenderism is somewhat confused with aligning it with homosexuality. Transgender people are not necessarily, or perhaps not even often, gay. It is often tied together with gay issues but perhaps that makes it even more difficult to understand transgender issues.
      It does seem that sometimes people are born into what they sincerely feel are the wrong bodies. It is a very real issue for some people.
      We certainly need more understanding of the science behind it all. And perhaps try to better understand those who are going through transgender issues

      Like

      • On Caitlyn Jenner, and pastoring a transgender person

        Jun 03, 2015 by MaryAnn McKibben Dana

        The Internet is awash with reactions to Caitlyn Jenner’s photos in Vanity Fair magazine. Some thoughtful stuff, and plenty that’s predictably … less than thoughtful. I write this post with some trepidation, because there’s still much for me to learn, and I hope those who have walked this road will offer correction with a generous spirit, for it’s in that spirit that I write this. This tip sheet from GLAAD is helpful.

        I had the opportunity to provide pastoral support to someone as she made a male-to-female transition. Her story is hers to tell, but this is a little of mine as I walked with her. (She was not on the membership rolls of any church I served. I say that to protect her identity and so people don’t go wondering and digging. I’ll call her Jade.)

        I felt this person’s anguish as we met over a period of months. It seems hard enough to be gay or lesbian, to go against society’s default expectations and perhaps one’s upbringing, to experience discrimination and sometimes harassment. But to be transgender—for one’s body not to conform to what one knows so deeply to be true of oneself—seems a particularly tough burden. Violence against transgender people is disproportionately high. For many (though not all) transgender people, the answer is surgery, or as I learned, surgeries. And of course, these procedures are expensive and very involved, and thus out of reach for many people.

        The person I met with asked me over and over again, “Am I a mistake? Does God make mistakes?” As someone who tries to be not only a straight ally, but a straight Christian ally, these questions felt important and agonizing. I read up on Christian resources for transgender people, and we talked a lot about Jesus’ ministry with society’s “misfits and outcasts.” We read the story of the Ethiopian eunuch, which to me is a clear sign that grace is a gift offered to sexual minorities too. Mainly I told her that the God I believe in loves us all unconditionally and wants shalom—wholeness—for us all.

        The first time we met, when she was still contemplating a physical transition and what it might mean, I prayed for her by name—her female name. When she raised her head her eyes were filled with tears. “I am Jade. That’s who I am.”

        I’ll be honest. It didn’t feel comfortable—I previously knew this person by a male name. But it was right. And this is what we do as pastors, isn’t it? It’s not about our own comfort. It’s about naming the grace of God that we are all living toward. It’s about claiming the abundant life that Jesus promises.

        And Jade claimed that abundant life. It wasn’t easy and it still isn’t. Loved ones don’t always get it. Family systems are complicated. But when I saw her after one of her surgeries, I couldn’t believe the transformation. I’m not talking about breast augmentation and a reduced Adam’s apple. I’m talking about the peace that radiated from every pore. I’m talking about the way she carried herself. I’m talking about the carefree smile she gave me. You’d have to be blind not to see it.

        Maybe, maybe, my prayer in which I invoked her new name was a gift to her. But that last meeting we had was a gift to me, because I saw wholeness and transformation in the flesh. I still don’t understand transgenderism. Is it a quirk of evolutionary biology? But I don’t have to understand it. My job is to point to abundant life, and then to celebrate as Jade and others seek to embody it.

        In the Big Book of Alcoholics Anonymous, there’s a saying, “Happy, joyous and free.” The gospel isn’t the gospel unless it moves us toward happy, joyous and free. That’s all I know.

        Originally posted at The Blue Room

        Like

      • Graeme, good on you for sticking with “Jade”, even though you may not have understood (and still don’t I presume). She is very lucky to have support from you. 🙂

        Like

      • I am not confusing gay and trans genderism. I have used both terms together though. LGTB which now has more letters after it. So just as this community names itself I am talking about sexual identity and picked up on gay and transgender. However they can overlap. I know of a man who was married with kids, who left and had a sex change to be a woman. Who was still attracted to women who thus was then a lesbian.

        Like

      • That’s not right Alexie. Gender identity and sexual orientation are two completely separate characteristics. One is what gender we see ourselves as being. The other is what gender(s) and sex(es) we are physically and romantically attracted to.

        Knowing one doesn’t tell you about the other.

        Like

    • If you’d like to see more of the science how hard are you looking ?

      You seem to have jumped right past the Kinsey scale when it comes to sexual attraction.

      How hard have you looked when it comes to transgender issues.

      Like

  3. Me Me Me Me It’s all about me. It’s always about me. Social Justice that is. My causes. My compensation. My being recognized/ tolerated. It’s these arrested teenagers’ causes of baby boomers and Gen X.

    It’s where the Catholic Church couldn’t quite express/ articulate its differences with this world. Christianity is about forgive and forget/ be reconciled – get on with life.

    Kennedy was actually ‘way’ pre baby boomer [May 29, 1917]: “Ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country.”

    Can you perceive even the slightest of differences between any John Kennedy pre 1960 and any Caitlyn Brenner post 1970? Even a paper thin crack of light opening to shine on such a topic?

    I didn’t think so. So scream bigot/ man the shrill tin whistles and point. And edit out all these hate speeches. All dissent must be hate – what other explanation could possibly exist? Because we love.

    Emergency doctors and nurses get physically psychologically tired of and exasperated by suicide attempts patients. Spending so much time and effort trying to help people who want to get well and contribute here comes some-one ‘ungrateful’ with what life is ‘to them’.

    No amount of recognition is ever enough. The peace process can’t work when no amount of recognition is ever enough. The marriage equality acts won’t be enough either.
    The world is not enough, just not good enough to give thanks for, even as it is.

    thus in another thirty years, you’ll be re writing this story about someone else’s victimhood in nearly exact same language. Will you have changed though? One iota?

    Like

    • In another 30 years will there still be narrow minded bigots spewing forth hateful bile.

      I’d imagine that there will be and that’s the greater tragedy.

      Like

      • Caitlyn Jenner’s new ‘feminized’ face reportedly cost $91,000 to achieve…..so I wouldn’t dismiss everything Phillip G. said about the “me, me, me” generation. And I wonder if God is really saying “well done good and faithful servants” to the “me, me, me” generation? I think those of us who are sitting in the lap of luxury need a good dose of reality.

        Like

      • So God has a concern with monetary limits ? iF only $5k was spent would that be ok with God ? Or is it just a couple of hundred ?

        What’s the Godly spending amount ?

        Like

      • I am not sure what the Godly amount would be but I know $50 will feed a child in Africa for a year.

        Like

  4. Christian television personality Pat Robertson recently commented about transgender people on his “700 Club” show, saying, “I think there are men who are in a woman’s body … I don’t think there’s any sin associated with that.” Liberals praised Robertson, while some Christians criticized him.

    Most conservative Christian’s arguments are rooted in Genesis 5:2: “[God] created them male and female.” This view states that one must be a certain way because one was born a certain way. If God makes humans with bodies of a particular gender, the argument goes, God did so intentionally.

    The argument sounds pretty convincing at first glance–who are we to change what God has ordained?–but not all the facts are being considered. For example, there is no mention of intersex people, which are those persons who have physical and genetic variations that do not allow them to be strictly designated as either male or female.

    According to research conducted by Anne Fausto-Sterling of Brown University, one in 100 children are born with “bodies that differ from standard male or female” biology. This includes those children born with both a penis and a vagina, as well as those with vaginal agenesis, ovatestes, or genetic disorders such as Klinefelter syndrome. Apparently, God sometimes creates humans both male and female or neither fully male nor fully female. –
    See more at: http://jonathanmerritt.religionnews.com/2013/08/19/transgender-issues-more-complicated-than-some-christians-portray/#sthash.22SgVNqn.dpuf

    Like

    • Yes. An older gynaecologist friend of mine, now deceased, told me there were quite a few times she had to decide very quickly whether to tell the mother she had just given birth to a boy or girl.

      But as well as the physical traits there are brain differences, from very early stages..

      “Estrogen and testosterone influence brain development, although the process of the way in which hormones and the brain interact to influence behavior is very complex. Louann Brizendine, MD, author of The Female Brain, points out that gender differences start before birth: female brains are flushed in utero with estrogen hormones, while male brains are washed with testosterone. Females begin studying faces as babies, which shapes their brain development. Research demonstrates that the skills of baby girls in making eye contact and facial gazing increases over 400% in the first three months of life, while facial gazing skills in boys doesn’t. In one study, year-old girls looked at their mothers faces 10 to 20 times more than boys checking for signs of approval or disapproval. While the boys, driven by testosterone, moved around the room to investigate their environment and rarely glanced at their mothers.”

      This is increased at puberty, when many hormones of the opposite gender to the physical traits, can flood the body.

      Like

      • I know the above is not always the case. ‘Normal’ boys and girls often get crushes on same gender idols, and grow out of it. They need to be very sure before they make vital changes.

        And again, many of both genders have suffered in a heterosexual relationship, and scared to try it again, They gain safety, companionship and comfort in a same sex relationship that is supportive, caring, and committed.

        What God wanted when humans were created and what He wants now don’t have to be the same. He may be the same yesterday, today and forever, but I am sure he takes changing circumstances and developments into account. Who knows if this is not part of His plan to bring about a heaven on Earth where there is no male and female as we know them now.

        “There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.”

        Like

      • Aargh! Strewth on June 5, 2015 at 19:20 said: “Yes. An older gynaecologist friend of mine,”
        For gynaecologist read obstetrician!

        Like

  5. More Sexual Madness

    Postscript

    Let me add a few extra paragraphs here from an expert on the subject. He argues that from a scientific viewpoint, there is no such thing as transgender. Here is how an article on this opens: “A prominent Toronto psychiatrist has severely criticized the assumptions underlying what has been dubbed by critics as the Canadian federal government’s ‘bathroom bill,’ that is, Bill C-279, a private member’s bill that would afford special protection to so-called ‘transgender’ men and women.

    “Dr. Joseph Berger has issued a statement saying that from a medical and scientific perspective there is no such thing as a ‘transgendered’ person, and that terms such as ‘gender expression’ and ‘gender identity’ used in the bill are at the very least ambiguous, and are more an emotional appeal than a statement of scientific fact.

    “Berger, who is a consulting psychiatrist in Toronto and whose list of credentials establishes him as an expert in the field of mental illness, stated that people who identify themselves as ‘transgendered’ are mentally ill or simply unhappy, and pointed out that hormone therapy and surgery are not appropriate treatments for psychosis or unhappiness.

    “‘From a scientific perspective, let me clarify what “transgendered” actually means,’ Dr. Berger said, adding, ‘I am speaking now about the scientific perspective – and not any political lobbying position that may be proposed by any group, medical or non-medical. “Transgendered” are people who claim that they really are or wish to be people of the sex opposite to which they were born, or to which their chromosomal configuration attests. Sometimes, some of these people have claimed that they are “a woman trapped in a man’s body” or alternatively “a man trapped in a woman’s body”. The medical treatment of delusions, psychosis or emotional happiness is not surgery’.”

    http://billmuehlenberg.com/2013/06/10/more-sexual-madness/

    Like

    • I reckon he’s right, Monica, about the cases he sees. They would have psychiatric issues. Others would not be going to him. Still others would not be of mixed or mistaken gender, but fit onto the gay or lesbian bracket.

      Those I know personally are mainly very stable people with no need for psychiatric help. Yet I do know some who have jumped on this bandwagon just because they can then claim to be persecuted. They are often the public face, unlike the lovely and loving majority.

      Like

      • There are numerous studies by a number of scientists into the presence of the transsexual characteristics of the human brain so Dr Berger’s claim that “Scientifically, there is no such a thing” is disingenuous to say the least. Would he say “normative sexuality” is also a figment of the collective imagination?

        Like

      • Hey Kylie,

        You’ll notice though that Dr. Berger sets up some very specific definitions of what “transgendered” is before he speaks about the “scientific perspective”

        Like

      • Actually Geoff,

        My mind was radically changed about a year ago when my daughter told me the story of the little four year boy in her school teacher friend’s class. He is convinced he is a girl, and no amount of parental punishment and counselling can persuade him he isn’t. It really was shocking for me to hear how much he is suffering because his parents are in denial. No, I can’t see this child ever ‘growing out of it’. And, bible bashing is certainly not the answer to this reality. But I’ll be the first to admit that I do feel uncomfortable whenever I find myself in a situation that I honestly do not know whether the adult I am speaking to is male or female. I still cannot get used to it.

        Like

      • Geoff,

        their suffering is very real. How could we not be moved by it. God bless.

        Like

  6. [It’s so much easier to pass this topic off on a man who could look good enough to pass the cover of Vanity Fair with just a few hundred thousand dollars surgery and hormone injections and pills – but with a natural eye to look at them a lot of humanity aren’t beautiful – anorexia can’t be cured with a plastic surgeon – suicides aren’t something that is solved with money thrown at it spending]

    Like

  7. Charismanews

    Walt has had sex-reassignment surgery twice. (CBN)
    Former Olympian Bruce Jenner has been hailed a hero by some in the LGBT community for his recent sex-change surgery and name change to Caitlyn.

    But one man who has changed sexes twice says that the transgender movement has left a trail of misery in its wake.

    Author and speaker Walt Heyer has experienced sex-change regret first hand.

    “The surgery fixed nothing—it only masked and exacerbated deeper psychological problems,” Heyer wrote in a recent article on Public Discourse.

    “If more people were aware of the dark and troubled history of sex-reassignment surgery, perhaps we wouldn’t be so quick to push people toward it,” he said.

    Is sex-change surgery the answer to gender dysphoria? How should the church respond to transgenders?

    “We need to be mindful that the church is a hospital for broken people. And as such, we need to be the people who administer assistance and guidance to those people who are suffering,” Heyer said.

    “We don’t want to leave them where they are. We want them to be healed and find the source of Christ in their life so they can be restored the way I have been,” he added.

    Like

    • Heyer is obviously a bigot because racis and anti-LGBT bigotry. They know.
      Hey, Hey, Bro. how many articles on ex-gays posted on these pages – none and never will be.

      Like

      • Interesting Kylie that two times you made the point about differences between gay and transgender. It seems the differences now do not count by your question. What do you think? That it may indeed be something out if tge ordinary. That the above comments by a transgender person may not apply in this situation.
        It seems you are out to score points and not actually discuss?

        Like

  8. I know another person who had a sex change and hated making this decision. This person also was not sure if they were gay, bi or heyerosexual. They had the sex change because the gay and transgender community push it along with some doctors.

    Like

    • Do you actually “know” this person Alexie? Or have you just heard about this person? Or just know someone who knows someone who…….

      Like

      • Are you asking because what i say goes against your line of thinking? So i must be confused or lying? You are a piece of work you are.

        Like

      • Yeah Kylie how dare you it’s well known the people making comments on the internet never ever ever exaggerate things or tell other than the perfect truth.

        Like

      • Hey Alexie,

        Get over yourself princess – if you do actually know this person then all you needed to do was answer. Yes it’s somebody that I knew.

        Avoiding the question and throwing insults about isn’t really the way to build any credibility.

        Like

    • Alexie,I was asking because it is likely that you don’t personally know anyone who is dealing with transgender issues. If you did you would realise that its is not so simple..

      Like

      • Likely? You do not even know me.
        I never once said it was simple.
        You have claimed a few things about me that are not true. You seem to make a premise, that is not true. Then use ut to shoot people.

        Like

  9. Kylie, read carefully what i have written. I am not saying they are the same.

    “Knowing one doesn’t tell you about the other”
    Rubbish.

    Like

    • “Bubba, me not answering tells you nothing.”

      Um well for a start it tell me that you’re not answering. Duh.

      And perhaps inferences can be drawn from that.

      Like

  10. For Kylie and Bubba

    I will just restate my original comment. Teice in case you do not read it properly the 2nd time.

    “I know another person who had a sex change and hated making this decision. This person also was not sure if they were gay, bi or heyerosexual. They had the sex change because the gay and transgender community push it along with some doctors.

    I know another person who had a sex change and hated making this decision. This person also was not sure if they were gay, bi or heyerosexual. They had the sex change because the gay and transgender community push it along with some doctors.”

    Like

    • It’s a difficult thing mate. I’m sure that for every story where gender realignment has not worked out you’d find another case where it did.
      As a Christian it seems to me that some people are born I nto the “wrong” bodies and we must acknowledge that it’s not just “in the head”.
      But as I say, it’s difficult to look at the grey areas if we are black and white about this issue. Frankly, I don’t know what’s wrong or right here and I would like to see more evidence. Not just the politics of it.

      Like

      • I agree its difficult. Some seem to get an odinary deal of confusion. In fact i believe its more complicated then some are saying here. Its not cut and dried and all possibilities are on the table.

        Like

  11. I know of another person who had teansgender issues. Yes, i do know more than one. This is interesting as he was “feeling” female for much of his life. He married and had children but he could not hide it any longer. He came out to his wife and a few men he trusted. He privately would wesr his wifes make up and clothing.
    Over several years if counselling he realised it stemmed from deep seated mental issues.
    He is now happy within himself and his marriage doing well.

    Like

    • Yeah for sure you do nothing with your time but hang out with folk with transgender issues.

      They’d be a fraction of the population but you know heaps right ?

      Like

    • Quoting single instances is not reliable. I also know of a man who in mid life, spontaneosly and naturally, he said, developed breasts and lost his facial hair. I’ll call him ‘Jake’. Being a natural sceptic I’m guessing this was actually assisted, rather than spontaneous, but his wife seemed convinced that it just happened naturally.

      He then went ahead with therapy to complete the change, so now I’ll call him/her ‘Jane’.. The wife was heart-broken at the time, but they grew into a close friendship and companionship, and the children, now adult, are fine with the situation.

      Like

    • “Logic said that if I was a girl, I should be attracted to boys.”

      Hmm you want to explain that one to my cousin and her wife ?

      Like

  12. “Alan Turing: Church, State, and the Tragedy of Gender-Defiant Genius
    by Maria Popova

    On the man who was caught between the past and the future in clothes a size too small, and profoundly changed our lives anyway.

    Little about your day so far, including reading this, would be the same were it not for logician, mathematician, brilliant eccentric, avid reader, and computer science pioneer Alan Turing (June 23, 1912–June 7, 1954). While he remains celebrated as instrumental in the invention of the computer, responsible for coining the very concepts of “computation” and “algorithm” in their present form, Turing — who has shaped nearly every facet of our modern lives — is also one of history’s most tragic figures. Beyond his intellectual prowess, another aspect of his character permeated his intellectual contribution and ultimately led to his untimely death, yet it remains at best a silent echo.

    In 1952, Turing was criminally prosecuted by the U.K. government for his homosexuality, illegal at the time, and forced to take female hormones to “cure” his unlawful “disorder” — a process known as chemical castration — as an alternative to a prison sentence. Less than two years later, shortly before his forty-second birthday, Turing committed suicide.”
    http://www.brainpickings.org/2012/06/22/alan-turing-100/

    Sometimes the issue of homosexuality and mixed or mistaken gender is confused and confusing.

    Like

  13. I read a lot of the comments and I am honestly trying to understand the transgender struggle, but it is something very foreign to me (never met one, never known anyone who struggled). But I wonder how much of this struggle is a modern day problem? From the beginning of time up until the last few decades, transgender surgery or medicine was not even a thought or possibility. How have humans addressed this before now? I don’t believe the only solution for this problem is surgery.

    Like

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s