A church on the ice and a cathedral made of Lego

ice

ICE fishing is a Canadian passion at this time of year. And a chapel on the ice has now been built for anglers heading out onto the ice of Lake Simcoe.

“It’s a place where people can pray before they go out and give thanks when they return,” said Rev. Canon Ted McCollum of St. Paul’s Anglican Church.

Donated by a parishioner, the modest ice-fishing shack is adorned by a cross over the door and features two bench seats, blankets and an area for prayer.

MEANHILE, Liverpool’s Anglican Cathedral has been recreated – in thousands of Lego bricks.

Peter Rogers, 60, from Stoneycroft, spent six months recreating the famous landmark in a 2.5 metre model currently being showcased in the Cathedral itself.

The model, which weighs around 100 kilos, was finally completed on December 18 after threats from Peter’s wife to clear the dining table for Christmas dinner.

He estimates that his successful attempt has used around £5000-worth of Lego bricks.

lego

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107 thoughts on “A church on the ice and a cathedral made of Lego

  1. …..especially when your daily routine includes blowing people up, or marrying-off pre-pubescent children to dirty-old men, hey Dom? (see the imam who was arrested yesterday for performing such a marriage, and the ‘husband’ who has been charged with 25 count’s of child-rape.

    But it’s funny about the ‘god-conscious’ thing. The israeli nazis are also god-conscious* as they kick down doors in the middle of the might and violently drag kids AS YOUNG as 4 YEARS of age out of their beds and throw them into a military prison, where they are physically and emotionally tortured, sometimes for months.

    Am I the only one who saw Four Corners last night? I know I’m not the only who hopes the other nazis are suffering in hell for not doing their ~ god-given! ~ job properly all those years ago.

    How’s it possible that there are people who don’t rage loud and long against the very existence of Occupied Palestine, let alone supports the occupiers?
    Yes….this means YOU!

    *as confirmed several times by some hard-faced, self-righteous female organiser and facilitator of ethnic-cleansing and illegal settlements….and a close colleague of that fascist criminal Ariel Sharon.

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-02-10/israeli-security-forces-accused-of-using-palestinian-children-/5248378

    ….and, surprise! surprise! most of the more damaging reports of the atrocities have been removed from google and other search-engines. Classical nazi censorship/media-manipulation.

    The famous photo of the jewish kid with his hands up being herded off to a concentration camp is pretty tame compared to some of the stuff seen on ABCTV last night.
    Do try to get a look at it.

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    • There are Jewish voices against the occupation. ‘Jews for Justice for Palestinians’, ‘Jewish Voice for Peace’ (the largest and most influential Jewish anti-Zionist group in the United States), ‘Jews Against the Occupation – Australia’ and so on. Google for lots more.

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      • Yes I know ~ get lots of their newsletters.

        There were also germans who spoke against (and plotted to kill) Hitler.
        The Four Corners program even interviewed on film some israeli ex- military leaders about the deplorable atrocities they were ‘forced’ to commit.
        Talk’s cheap.

        Since nontheless:-

        “The UNICEF report concluded that ill treatment of Palestinian children in the Israeli military detention system appeared to be “widespread, systematic and institutionalised”.

        The report said: “Children have been threatened with death, physical violence, solitary confinement and sexual assault*, against themselves or a family member.
        “Most children confess at the end of the interrogation.”

        *rape, actually ~ and been confronted in the torture-chamber be the ‘rapist’.

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      • The israelis happily and consistently DEFY the US government and the UN and everybody else. (Obama was over there just recently trying to reign them in. They pissed in his pocket and sent him home.)

        If the ‘jews against the bastardries’ were for real they’;d STOP SUPPORTING THE ‘STATE OF ISRAEL’ .

        ….and so would the germans and everybody else.

        But it’ll never happen.
        Perhaps their god IS pulling the strings.

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      • Why should Israel listen to the UN and Obama? I wouldn’t. They would be the last people I would listen to.

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      • General Moshe Dayan: “Israel must be like a mad dog, too dangerous to bother.”
        Everyone knows the only remedy for a mad dog is to shoot it.

        Indeed?…..”Why should Israel listen to the UN and Obama? I wouldn’t. They would be the last people I would listen to.”

        Would you believe the jews who had participated ~ and in some cases directed ~ such ‘operations’ for years; or the israeli leaders and parliamentarians who make no secret of the fact that this has been long-standing policy,
        …….and who publicly express pride in this ‘weapon against terrorism’ they’ve developed? (Though since the Four Corners program have

        How about countless reels of very graphic video/digital film recorded by the ABC/BBC/ALJEZEERA and endless other reasonably respectable news-agencies? The numbers of international reporters and observers who have been killed by israeli troops tells a story in itself ~ as does the israeli record of piracy and multiple murder on the high seas.

        … or the massacre of hundreds/thousands of refugees at Sabra and Shatila for which even an israeli ‘commission of enquiry’ declared Sharon ‘personally responsible’.
        (though the israeli army apparently didn’t commit the actual murders; they cordoned off the camps and sent in the christian militias to do the dirty work.
        I wonder if Jesus was watching.

        As I said, there’s NO secret about any of this; the nazis take pride in their work because they’re doing ‘god’s work.’ ….again.
        ….so it surprises me that the influence of international jewry has gone to the trouble of having the more specific and damning reports of this latest expose removed from online access.

        These are also the misbred mongrels who, more than once, have threatened to use their illegal stockpile of nukes to attack anybody they choose to on political grounds (eg Iran) , and who ~ via the ‘Samson Option’ , a scheme engineered by that resurrected Hitler, Sharon, ~ which threatens to take the whole world down with them (and specifies ‘Rome’) in the event they look like being overwhelmed. Even way back when, Golda Meir at one point ordered israeli nukes readied for use against the arabs.

        Not listening to the UN and obama ~ or anyone else ~ is fine.
        But do try to do so from an informed position.

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      • They can’t make reparations for mass-murder, enslavement and ethnic-cleansing, Mon.
        And they won’t.
        The brutal-faced (and almost smiling) colleague of Sharon’s made it clear over and over again that god gave them this land, that they”d hold it by whatever methods suited them and that there was NO ROOM for anyone but jews in palestine. Meanwhile, Sharon has been made a national hero. (and here in Oz, too, according to the fed. govt.)
        I wish you’d seen the program: it made my gut churn, and I’m tougher than you are.
        ….and the worst of it may have been that nobody made a secret of what was going on: if anything, they were proud of it.

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      • Thanks Mon. I’m not IT savvy enough to know where to look much beyond the normal search-engines.
        And will try to record it for posterity; hopefully can get the sound on disc.

        I think my bottom line is that homosapiens are destroying the world and everything in it (even reptiles and rodents have a greater care and respect for their young than we do: how degenerate is THAT!?) and in almost every case that destruction can be tracked back to our invention of gods. (or systems derived from them).
        Even my constant complaint about overpopulation traces back to ‘holy writ’; most other animals stop breeding when resources get scarce enough.

        But not us; god will provide…….
        Yeah. Right.

        I’m not the only one whose life swings between despair and rage these days.
        Something’s gotta give: and this time round it may not be only the weak and helpless that get it where it hurts……
        ……hm. perhaps it’s not all bad after all!

        Keep smiling.

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      • Yeah. Getting sprung sometimes helps….or not.
        These (chosen) creatures have, according to THEIR OWN history, been butchering children quote without mercy unquote since before the days of Deuteronomy. —> remember when Moses (following god’s instructions ~ again!) sent the Levites in to kill thousands of other jews, including the children?

        It makes me sad that the Jesus character/christianity is insistently identified with the inbred ~ and racist ~ murdering scum which has never in history managed (deliberately) to get on with their neighbours/hosts.

        Jews aren’t universally detested for no reason.

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    • I watched the doco Dabs,

      And thanks for alerting us to it. Yep, I cried. There is no excuse, and the report wasn’t biased. I’ve heard it all before.

      It can’t continue to go on like this. Something has to give and when it does, God help us, I think.

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      • Palestinian Child Sacrifice
        “During the Cold War, Sting hoped ‘the Russians loved their children too.’ Sadly, if Australian Darly Johns is right, Israel cannot entertain the same hope about their Palestinian neighbours .Johns was so affected by media pictures of dead and wounded Palestinian children, allegedly the victims of Israeli aggression that she decided to do something about it. She went as a volunteer peace activist in the Palestinian Authority but when she arrived she was greeted by a far different reality. Johns discovered to her horror that Arab children are actually the victims of child abuse from their own society.The following video is one of the most moving and disturbing I have ever seen. In it, Johns tearfully recounts how she came to realise that many of the children whose pictures she had been presented as evidence of Israel’s cruelty had in fact died while attacking Jewish men, women and children at the behest of their elders.The video includes clips of Palestinian children reciting hatred for the Jews and expressing a deep desire not for peace, but for war and Israel’s demise.”

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      • Deplorable as it is to get kids involved in any of this bullshit ~ including the anzac-day marches, etc, ~ why would anyone do other than recite ” hatred for the Jews and expressing a deep desire not for peace, but for war and Israel’s demise.” ??

        Given the geographic, political and ethnic history, Hitler’s claims on poland (along with racist claims of superiority) were much more reasonable than the jewish claim on palestine,
        ….and the whole world went to war to tell him he was wrong.

        I repeat ~ and will argue the toss if you like ~ that the german nazis had a more legitimate claim on poland than the jewish nazis have on palestine.

        ,,,,and if you were old enough to remember life in OZ during the war you might also remember the hatred that was preached (and adopted by the kids) here,too. Before I turned five y.o. I started school here FOUR YEARS AFTER THE WAR ENDED , and still had to fight every day against accusations of nazi-baby-eater, etc etc. by other five-year-olds.
        …..and they WEREN’T living in a military-style concentration camp.

        My mother cried when she explained why they did it; and right there is where my blazing hatred of bullies began.

        Make no mistake:- judaism is founded in racist bullying, and “peace” the furtherest thing from its mind.
        Jewish history speaks for itself.

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      • ps. in the linked gallery of photos you might notice the “aggressive palestinian” about 7 or 8 years old about to attack, with a stone, a 50-ton israeli battle-tank in his neighbourhood, which they were about to ‘appropriate’. Rotten little terrorist!

        But I reiterate:- Jews have no RIGHT (except for ‘might’) to be in palestine, nor any more desire for ‘living in peace’ with ANYone, than they did the first time they treacherously stole the country from people who’d made them welcome and committed the genocide of their hosts: men, women and children….and goats and asses and everything else.

        “Without mercy” ~ god (Deuteronomy 7/elsewhere)
        Even if god did exist, who, with any self-respect or compassion, would want to know the motherless mongrel?

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      • I think so too, Mon. But suggest that as always, far from helping us, when the shit hits the fan god won’t be anywhere to be found.

        Perhaps he doesn’t like getting his hands dirty.

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      • Dabbles, I remember hearing this quote from Golda Meir that peace will come when the Arabs love their children more than they hate us.

        You have an issue with the Jews, maybe because of your past – even though in the clip I’ve provided it shows that children are being pushed to the forefront of this battle by their own families. I feel sorry for those children, yes because of the Jewish retaliation against them (they must always keep in mind that they are children) but also because they are being used in this battle like fodder by their own people.

        People could argue till the end of the world who owns what land – worldwide. If only the Jews were allowed to live in peace in their own land, they would not need this border of protection – but I can’t see that happening.

        Maybe the Jewish people should pack up and leave when we here in Australia leave and return the country to the Aborigines? Afterall, we’ve only lived here a couple a hundred years.

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      • “and if you were old enough to remember life in OZ during the war you might also remember the hatred that was preached (and adopted by the kids) here,too. Before I turned five y.o. I started school here FOUR YEARS AFTER THE WAR ENDED , and still had to fight every day against accusations of nazi-baby-eater, etc etc. by other five-year-olds.”

        Obviously that is not the fault of the Jews is it Dabbles. They weren’t the ones abusing you, they were the ones dying. Don’t hold it against them.

        I have never personally experienced racism (I look Australian) – but my father did and to the point where one man was so incensed because he thought my wog father was dating his sister – he shot her. He was shocked, hurt, angered, yes – but you can’t let that fester or it takes over your life. He continued to have Australian mates because you can’t paint a whole people with the same brush. Ultimately the cycle has to end.

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      • Ah, Kathleen, therein lies the immutable stumbling-block: the unswerving, devotional, unquestioned basis for all claims:-
        ” If only the Jews were allowed to live in peace in their own land,”

        And it’s a falsity; Palestine is NOT “their own land”. It never was.

        I can’t believe that, with that attitude, you were so ‘shocked’ recently at the suggestion that ramping a bank could be justified.

        ….and you a catholic!
        Remember, the jews DID kill Jesus ~ whether he was god or not.

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      • Making up the history again Dabs…..

        Just FYI. I came across this view today:

        Mohammed was honest and acknowledged the special relationship of the Jewish people with God and the land He gave them: From the Koran:

        [Sura 5:20] Recall that Moses said to his people (the Jews), “O my people, remember GOD’s blessings upon you: He appointed prophets from among you, made you kings, and granted you what He never granted any other people.”

        [Sura 5:21] “O my people, enter the holy land (Israel) that GOD has decreed for you, and do not rebel, lest you become losers.”

        Later in the Koran, in order to make it clear and leave no doubts that the Jewish G-d had given ownership of the land to and set the mission of the Jews, Mohammed took additional time to repeat the writing of the Torah in Sura 7 about the Jews and Moses:

        [Sura 7:137] “We let the oppressed people inherit the land, east and west, and we blessed it. The blessed commands of your Lord were thus fulfilled for the Children of Israel, to reward them for their steadfastness, and we annihilated the works of Pharaoh and his people and everything they harvested.”

        [Sura 7:144] He said, “O Moses, I have chosen you (the Jews), out of all the people, with My messages and by speaking to you. Therefore, take what I have given you and be appreciative

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  2. …and incidentally, you do know, don’t you, that israel was thick-as-thieves with that other racist-supremacist government, the south african apartheid regime, onselling weapons, ‘intellingence’ and other military/security (read ‘population-suppressing) stuff.
    ….and, of course,collaborating on the development of illegal nukes. (I remember the puzzled news-reports about the unexplained ‘flash’ that happened off the south african coast, and which was eventually written-off as a UFO of some sort.
    Good media-manupulation.

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    • Now that you’ve had your little rant and foaming at the mouth about Israel and Palestine please provide the links to prove that Israelis are carrying out these atrocities at the behest of their God. Can you prove that this is a religious war by Israelis on the Palestinians Dabbles?

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  3. Not everyone agrees with you Dabs.

    How Strong Is the Arab Claim to Palestine?
    By Lawrence Auster

    There is a myth hanging over all discussion of the Palestinian problem: the myth that this land was “Arab” land taken from its native inhabitants by invading Jews. Whatever may be the correct solution to the problems of the Middle East, let’s get a few things straight:

    As a strictly legal matter, the Jews didn’t take Palestine from the Arabs; they took it from the British, who exercised sovereign authority in Palestine under a League of Nations mandate for thirty years prior to Israel’s declaration of independence in 1948. And the British don’t want it back.

    If you consider the British illegitimate usurpers, fine. In that case, this territory is not Arab land but Turkish land, a province of the Ottoman Empire for hundreds of years until the British wrested it from them during the Great War in 1917. And the Turks don’t want it back.

    If you look back earlier in history than the Ottoman Turks, who took over Palestine in 1517, you find it under the sovereignty of the yet another empire not indigenous to Palestine: the Mamluks, who were Turkish and Circassian slave-soldiers headquartered in Egypt. And the Mamluks don’t even exist any more, so they can’t want it back.

    So, going back 800 years, there’s no particularly clear chain of title that makes Israel’s title to the land inferior to that of any of the previous owners. Who were, continuing backward:

    The Mamluks, already mentioned, who in 1250 took Palestine over from:

    The Ayyubi dynasty, the descendants of Saladin, the Kurdish Muslim leader who in 1187 took Jerusalem and most of Palestine from:

    The European Christian Crusaders, who in 1099 conquered Palestine from:

    The Seljuk Turks, who ruled Palestine in the name of:

    The Abbasid Caliphate of Baghdad, which in 750 took over the sovereignty of the entire Near East from:

    The Umayyad Caliphate of Damascus, which in 661 inherited control of the Islamic lands from
    The Arabs of Arabia, who in the first flush of Islamic expansion conquered Palestine in 638 from:

    The Byzantines, who (nice people—perhaps it should go to them?) didn’t conquer the Levant, but, upon the division of the Roman Empire in 395, inherited Palestine from:

    The Romans, who in 63 B.C. took it over from:

    The last Jewish kingdom, which during the Maccabean rebellion from 168 to 140 B.C. won control of the land from:

    The Hellenistic Greeks, who under Alexander the Great in 333 B.C. conquered the Near East from:

    The Persian Empire, which under Cyrus the Great in 639 B.C. freed Jerusalem and Judah from:

    The Babylonian empire, which under Nebuchadnezzar in 586 B.C. took Jerusalem and Judah from:

    The Jews, meaning the people of the Kingdom of Judah, who, in their earlier incarnation as the Israelites, seized the land in the 12th and 13th centuries B.C. from:

    The Canaanites, who had inhabited the land for thousands of years before they were dispossessed by the Israelites.

    As the foregoing suggests, any Arab claim to sovereignty based on inherited historical control will not stand up. Arabs are not native to Palestine, but are native to Arabia, which is called Arab-ia for the breathtakingly simple reason that it is the historic home of the Arabs. The territories comprising all other “Arab” states outside the Arabian peninsula, including Iraq, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon, Egypt, Tunisia, and Algeria, as well as the entity now formally under the Palestinian Authority, were originally non-Arab nations that were conquered by the Muslim Arabs when they spread out from the Arabian peninsula in the first great wave of jihad in the 7th century, defeating, mass-murdering, enslaving, dispossessing, converting, or reducing to the lowly status of dhimmitude millions of Christians and Jews and destroying their ancient and flourishing civilizations. Prior to being Christian, of course, these lands had even more ancient histories. Pharaonic Egypt, for example, was not an Arab country through its 3,000 year history.

    The recent assertion by the Palestinian Arabs that they are descended from the ancient Canaanites whom the ancient Hebrews displaced is absurd in light of the archeological evidence. There is no record of the Canaanites surviving their destruction in ancient times. History records literally hundreds of ancient peoples that no longer exist. The Arab claim to be descended from Canaanites is an invention that came after the 1964 founding of the Palestine Liberation Organization, the same crew who today deny that there was ever a Jewish temple in Jerusalem. Prior to 1964 there was no “Palestinian” people and no “Palestinian” claim to Palestine; the Arab nations who sought to overrun and destroy Israel in 1948 planned to divide up the territory amongst themselves. Let us also remember that prior to the founding of the state of Israel in 1948, the name “Palestinian” referred to the Jews of Palestine.

    In any case, today’s “Palestine,” meaning the West Bank and Gaza, is, like most of the world, inhabited by people who are not descendants of the first human society to inhabit that territory. This is true not only of recently settled countries like the United States and Argentina, where European settlers took the land from the indigenous inhabitants several hundred years ago, but also of ancient nations like Japan, whose current Mongoloid inhabitants displaced a primitive people, the Ainu, aeons ago. Major “native” tribes of South Africa, like the Zulu, are actually invaders from the north who arrived in the 17th century. India’s caste system reflects waves of fair-skinned Aryan invaders who arrived in that country in the second millennium BC. One could go on and on.

    The only nations that have perfect continuity between their earliest known human inhabitants and their populations of the present day are Iceland, parts of China, and a few Pacific islands. The Chinese case is complicated by the fact that the great antiquity of Chinese civilization has largely erased the traces of whatever societies preceded it, making it difficult to reconstruct to what extent the expanding proto-Chinese displaced (or absorbed) the prehistoric peoples of that region. History is very sketchy in regard to the genealogies of ancient peoples. The upshot is that “aboriginalism,” the proposition that the closest descendants of the original inhabitants of a territory are the rightful owners, is not tenable in the real world. It is not clear that it would be a desirable idea even if it were tenable. Would human civilization really be better off if there had been no China, no Japan, no Greece, no Rome, no France, no England, no Ireland, no United States?

    Back to the Arabs

    I have no problem recognizing the legitimacy of the Arabs’ tenure in Palestine when they had it, from 638 to 1099, a period of 461 years out of a history lasting 5,000 years. They took Palestine by military conquest, and they lost it by conquest, to the Christian Crusaders in 1099. Of course, military occupation by itself does not determine which party rightly has sovereignty in a given territory. Can it not be said that the Arabs have sovereign rights, if not to all of Israel, then at least to the West Bank, by virtue of their majority residency in that region from the early Middle Ages to the present?

    To answer that question, let’s look again at the historical record. Prior to 1947, as we’ve discussed, Palestine was administered by the British under the Palestine Mandate, the ultimate purpose of which, according to the Balfour Declaration, was the establishment of a Jewish national home in Palestine. In 1924 the British divided the Palestine Mandate into an Arabs-only territory east of the Jordan, which became the Kingdom of Trans-Jordan, and a greatly reduced Palestine Mandate territory west of the Jordan, which was inhabited by both Arabs and Jews.

    Given the fact that the Jews and Arabs were unable to coexist in one state, the British decided that there had to be two states. At the same time, there were no natural borders separating the two peoples, in the way that, for example, the Brenner Pass has historically marked the division between Latin and Germanic Europe. Since the Jewish population was concentrated near the coast, the Jewish State had to start at the coast and go some distance inland. Exactly where it should have stopped, and where the Arab state should have begun, was a practical question that could have been settled in any number of peaceful ways, almost all of which the Jews would have accepted. The Jews’ willingness to compromise on territory was demonstrated not only by their acquiescence in the UN’s 1947 partition plan, which gave them a state with squiggly, indefensible borders, but even by their earlier acceptance of the 1937 Peel Commission partition plan, which gave them nothing more than a part of the Galilee and a tiny strip along the coast.

    Yet the Arab nations, refusing to accept any Jewish sovereignty in Palestine even if it was the size of a postage stamp, unanimously rejected the 1937 Peel plan, and nine years later they violently rejected the UN’s partition plan as well. When the Arabs resorted to arms in order to wipe out the Jews and destroy the Jewish State, they accepted the verdict of arms. They lost that verdict in 1948, and they lost it again in 1967, when Jordan, which had annexed the West Bank in 1948 (without any objections from Palestinian Arabs that their sovereign nationhood was being violated), attacked Israel from the West Bank during the Six Day War despite Israel’s urgent pleas that it stay out of the conflict, and Israel in self-defense then captured the West Bank. The Arabs thus have no grounds to complain either about Israel’s existence (achieved in ’48) or about its expanded sovereignty from the river to the sea (achieved in ’67).

    The Arabs have roiled the world for decades with their furious protest that their land has been “stolen” from them. One might take seriously such a statement if it came from a pacifist people such as the Tibetans, who had quietly inhabited their land for ages before it was seized by the Communist Chinese in 1950. The claim is laughable coming from the Arabs, who in the early Middle Ages conquered and reduced to slavery and penury ancient peoples and civilizations stretching from the borders of Persia to the Atlantic; who in 1947 rejected an Arab state in Palestine alongside a Jewish state and sought to obliterate the nascent Jewish state; who never called for a distinct Palestinian Arab state until the creation of the terrorist PLO in 1964, sixteen years after the founding of the State of Israel; and who to this moment continue to seek Israel’s destruction, an object that would be enormously advanced by the creation of the Arab state they demand. The Arab claim to sovereign rights west of the Jordan is only humored today because of a fatal combination of world need for Arab oil, leftist Political Correctness that has cast the Israelis as “oppressors,” and, of course, good old Jew-hatred.

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    • I’m still waiting to hear how this whole Israeli conflict against Palestinians is in any way religiously motivated, given that most Israelis are atheist in practice only attending synagogues because of tradition and custom (as opposed to devotion to God).

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    • All sheer and IRRELEVANT bullshit Monica, based on crap premises.
      If I had the time I’d pull it apart line by embarrassingly self-serving line.

      Meanwhile, how’d you like it if a tribe of blackfellas ( who ALSO WEREN’T THE ORIGINAL OWNERS OF THIS COUNTRY) turned up and butchered a good few of your family and hunted the rest of them, under threat of death and worse, out into the mulga without their belongings and with restrictions on even how much water they could take out of the river?

      Whether the palestinians are or are not descendents of the canaanites, or arabs or bavarian chicken-farmers or anything else is IRRELEVANT.
      This arsehole you quote is doing nothing other than building a giant strawman, in support of the zionist agenda. He’s a right-wing (read ‘fascist’) jew.
      What WOULD you expect him to say?

      The bottom line is still: jews invaded and stole palestine at gunpoint, and killed anyone who got in the way. And then told lies/propagandised to ‘justify what they’d done.

      And, given the history, the german nazis (who pulled the same stunt in poland and elsewhere) learnt the technique from the jews, not the other way around.

      ,,,,, and they learned to invoke the favour of their conveniently- DIY ‘god’ to explain the necessity of mass-murder, just like the ‘christians’ and virtually every other murderous religion has, each in their own time. (And here I include ideologies like communism.)

      God is the universal copout for the worst elements and activities of our species.
      He should be drowned in a sewer…and then the sewer disinfected.

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      • It’s lucky a computer-glitch just ‘disappeared’ my ps in re the above:- you’d really have had something to complain about. Don’t have time to resurrect it now.

        I’m neither a racist nor ‘anti-semitic’ (thought that was sorted out long ago).
        In fact, one of my main gripes is that the jews ~ the longest-standing and most insidious ~ not to mention murderous ~ exclusive racist groups in the history of the world are allowed to get away with being that and ethnically-cleansing entire populations in the name of it.
        It’s the sort of thing that makes me ashamed of being a human.
        History will paint us all with the same brush.

        I’m prepared to back up every comment I make with facts, and if someone else wants to refute anything I’m happy to look at any facts they want to produce. I don’t have an axe to grind ~ other than the documented realities ~ and aren’t even particularly fond of palestinians (arab or otherwise) in any case. From what I’ve seen of them I woudn’t want to be living next door to them either.

        But that’s not the point. There’s no ‘justification’ for what the jews are doing, not even the claim that other would do it to them if they could.

        Is it a ‘crackpot rant’ to insist that murdering children is NEVER excused by the murder of children?

        Or that the bastards who brought the children to the killing fields should NEVER be allowed to get away with it,
        …..let alone rewarded?

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      • No it wasn’t sorted out ages ago. You just think so. I love you Dabs (truly do) but you do sometimes have an axe to grind and it’s called racism whatever way you look at it. Another word might be anti-semitic. There’s no justification for what a lot of people have done in the Middle East, including Palestinians.

        You know that I don’t blame any particular group for what happens there. The blame is shared.

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      • Yep. I do know that:- “You know that I don’t blame any particular group for what happens there.”
        ….and you ought to be ashamed of yourself.

        …and incidentally, would you REALLY deny that the very heart of judaism, and it’s entire purpose, is supremacist racism??
        …..That’s not a rhetorical question; do the deliberately inbred jews make a point of keeping their race ‘pure’ as befits the ‘Chosen’ Master-race?

        What say you?

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      • ??? “Would I REALLY deny that the very heart of judaism, and it’s entire purpose, is supremacist racism? Yes I do.”

        What, then, do YOU say the ‘god-dictated’ purpose of it’s racial-purity policy is?
        …and how does it differ in fundamental principle or practice from that of the german-nazi version?

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      • Yep!…….”Yeah and Arabs generally marry Arabs, Indians generally marry Indians and …and….and…..”
        ….and we know what often happens when they don’t.
        ….everybody agrees that racism is rife ~ except in judaism, apparently 😉
        ********************
        ……and yep! —> “BTW I know of quite a few non-Jews who have married Jews. But I guess they don’t count!”
        There are always the exceptions that prove the rule ~ and thank god that’s so; it’s where I live.
        Deliberately.

        BTW…..do you know any jews who have married non-jews??
        (think about it)

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    • Brilliant summary Monica.

      And this gets to the heart of it –

      “The Jews’ willingness to compromise on territory was demonstrated not only by their acquiescence in the UN’s 1947 partition plan, which gave them a state with squiggly, indefensible borders, but even by their earlier acceptance of the 1937 Peel Commission partition plan, which gave them nothing more than a part of the Galilee and a tiny strip along the coast.

      Yet the Arab nations, refusing to accept any Jewish sovereignty in Palestine even if it was the size of a postage stamp, unanimously rejected the 1937 Peel plan, and nine years later they violently rejected the UN’s partition plan as well.”

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      • I will try to reconstitute the lost post to Monica ~ it adresses the propaganda
        But meanwhile here are a couple of points to keep in mind:-

        1… The post-war jews had NO right to land in palestine, let alone to claim “even a tiny piece” of it….Any more than the other nazis had a right to claim ‘tiny pieces’ of czechslovakia (even though the british agreed that they should do so) or to bits of poland, etc.
        2……The british had NO right to even consider handing handing over a portion of palestine, not even a single sand-dune: it wasn’t theirs to give.
        3….. The british, in fact DIDN’T ‘GIVE’ palestine to the jews; weakened and impoverished by two world wars they were driven out by jewish-version jihadist terrorists. —->
        http://guardian.150m.com/palestine/jewish-terrorism.htm

        How’d you feel if a tribe of blackfellas (who also aren’t the original inhabitants of this continent) turned up at your door ~ and the doors of all your relatives ~ to evict the lot of you on the basis that someone who had no authority to do so had suggested it? (and they’d STILL have a more legitimate claim than the jews did in palestine)

        What if, then, they butchered a fair percentage of your extended family and hunted the rest of them out into the mulga, without their possessions and even with strict limits on the amount of water they could take out of the river?
        And what if every now and again, as the mood took them, they organised hunting-parties to go after your remaining relatives just to remind them that they’d better not get any uppity ideas……even if those refugee relatives were then living in new zealand or indonesia?

        Do you think you’d be inclined to do a deal with them which ‘legalised’ their sovereignty over a part of your property, even just ” the size of a postage stamp”? Or how about a “partition” in order to establish ‘peaceful co-existence’,,,,even though it was commonly known ~ and never denied ~ that all that was just a ploy to enable your complete disenfranchisement?

        I really would be interested in what you’d say. Please do share it with all of us.

        ps I’ll MAKE time to demolish the case put by Lawrence Auster, a right-wing (read fascist) zionist jew.
        WTF would expect him to say??
        …..and it’s ALL either irrelevant, misleading or strawman-building.

        How’s THAT for a “summary”?

        Like

      • ??? “That’s not a summary of facts. It’s an opinion. Some may call what you say propaganda.”
        Got an example of lack of factuality?
        ….and ‘propaganda’ ~ do you mean my (longish) question of Kathleen as regards the enforced claims of the (non-jewish) blackfellas?

        Why do YOU say the jews had any right to invade and claim even a tiny
        part of palestine.

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      • No, no Bryan! (“Funny, because he looks a bit like you!!!”)

        I TOLD you that was a copy of me sitting on the scanner…… 🙂

        Like

      • No it’s not the same as “bloody catholics”.
        Catholics are catholics by choice (disregarding for the moment the issue of brainwashing little kids).
        But jews are BORN jews.
        On what other basis can you claim Jesus was a jew?
        (Adam was also the ‘son of god’ according to the gospels, but nobody’s ever claimed he was a jew, have they?)

        So….Why WAS Jesus a jew?

        Like

      • Indeed…”But it ain’t the same as facts.’

        But you don’t LIKE facts,
        ….and often won’t countenance them

        Like

  4. Of course there are racist Jews, as there are racist atheists and racist Christians. Jews are humans. Take into account that Jews have varying beliefs. There are branches and denominations – you can find some here – http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outline_of_Judaism#Branches_and_denominations

    The index here is

    Judaism
    Jewish religious movements
    Rabbinic Judaism
    Pharisees
    Sadducees
    Orthodox Judaism
    Haredi Judaism
    Hasidic Judaism
    Misnagdim
    Neturei Karta
    Hardal
    Religious Zionism
    Modern Orthodox Judaism
    Conservadox Judaism
    Conservative Judaism
    Masorti
    Conservadox Judaism
    Reform Judaism
    Progressive Judaism
    Reconstructionist Judaism
    Jewish Renewal
    Karaite Judaism
    Samaritan
    Humanistic Judaism

    I haven’t examined them all, but my Jewish friend’s faith, Liberal Judaism, isn’t obvious.

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      • The beliefs of Liberal Judaism are outlined in The Affirmations of Liberal Judaism. …….. states “Judaism has never stood still. It has always moved forward, sometimes slowly, sometimes faster. Its history is a history of continuity and change. We affirm the dynamic, developing character of our Jewish religious tradition.”[35] This view represents the idea that divine laws were not something that happened at one specific moment on Mt. Sinai, but rather as an evolving ideal representing Judaism’s historic development through each succeeding generation.[36]

        To quote the movement’s website, “Liberal Judaism reverences Jewish tradition, and seeks to preserve the values of the Judaism of the past while giving them contemporary force. It aspires to a Judaism that is always an active force for good in the lives of Jewish individuals, families and communities today, and equally makes its contribution to the betterment of society.”[37] And it stresses “the full equality and participation of men and women in every sphere of religious life; an emphasis on ethical conduct above ritual observance; an affirmation of each individual’s freedom to act responsibly in accordance with the dictates of the informed religious conscience; a pride in combining our Jewish heritage with full participation in the civic life of this country; and an awareness of our duty not only to the Jewish people and to the State of Israel, but also to the entire human family, each one of whom is created in the Divine image”.[38]

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      • Of course there are christian and atheist racists, Strewth: I’ve seen them lived with them and been the victim of them. (until I learnt to fight)

        But it THE fundamental tenet of christianity or atheism.
        Racism IS the fundamental element of judaism, and has been since Abraham and god had their chat.But it’s not just a religious thing; it’s been fairly rigidly maintained in jewish culture, religion, politics and business and social structures, etc. etc. etc.

        A needy single mother I knew years ago was battling to find a rental in StKilda near where she worked to support her kids , and finally found an ideal place, and was warmly welcomed into the neighbourhood,,,,,until it was learnt that despite her dark appearance and assertive nature she wasn’t in fact jewish and was told she’d have to move.

        Admittance to exclusive jewish schools doesn’t even depend on one’s degree of ‘religiosity’, but on whether the family is ‘jewish’, and the kid circumcised.

        I used to see a jewish doctor, who was competent and witty and cheerful ~ if a bit supercilious. We got on well on a personal level. One day I walked in unexpectedly and there was a large pile of Australian banknotes on the table, and several ‘hard’ men counting it. (and keep in mind I knew hardcases when I saw them)

        I couldn’t have picked it then, but have seen large sums of cash since, and reckon there was at least a couple of million dollars on the table.
        (a LOT in 1984)

        Long story short:- it had been collected from local jews, willingly or otherwise, and was being sent to the US to help get Ronald Reagan elected because he was a friend of israel’s……whereas Jimmy Carter wasn’t. The ‘evaluation’ wasn’t religious-based.

        I could go on, but there’s NO denying that judaism is BASED on racism ~ as is the State of israel.
        Not even the israelis ~ or jews generally ~ deny it……not with a straight face anyway.

        Why do wussy christians and other ‘liberals’ insist it isn’t so?
        Might one suggest it’s the sophisticated ‘grooming’ that’s created a guilty complex for ‘sins’ of the past?

        Ask your jewish friends WHY they’re jewish. My money says the response ~ if there IS one ~ will be some variation of: We were born that way. And if pressed will allow that they weren’t born religious-jewish, but racial-jewish.

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  5. I was taught to see Israel as God’s suffering servant, chosen by God to save the world through servant-hood to Him, not chosen as ‘the lucky ones’. Just as Christians believe of Jesus.

    Like

    • Sort of a Make-Work project for the god of all the uninverses??
      A patchwork coat of many colours to keep god’s hands too busy to do the devil’s work, sort of thing?
      ……..doing evil by proxy, which absolves Him of blame.

      hm

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      • Dabs, you are talking I presume about the Hebrews, and a considerable time ago. I think in Old Testament times life was fairly precarious, and all ethnic groups had a need to band together against others, for survival. The roots of racism were everywhere then, not just with the Jews.

        Jesus showed a better way.

        There were people then (and now), of all ethnicities, who could think outside the box. Did you look into those various branched of Judaism listed? Yes, there are some, like the Zionists, who are very legalistic, and seem to be still living in the O.T. There are others, and many who are Jews in name only, or who only keep the traditional fasts and feasts (like many nominal Christians keep Christmas and Easter) – who live totally in the present day with all its education, understanding, and empathy towards other peoples.

        If others today haven’t reached this ‘enlightenment’, don’t blame certain Jews for not having done so.

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    • Moses knew as well as Hitler did that easily the best way to keep a lot of people together and make them easy to manipulate is to set them apart and create a common threat.
      And common suffering ties people together far more securely than anything else ~ including common superiority.
      It’s why the israelis even while they’re threatening the whole world and murdering their neighbours, consistently insist it’s because of the threat the poor jews face of suffering another ‘holcaust’.
      It’s why they have embedded the horrors of the war years into their individual and tribal consciousness.

      I’ve sometimes wondered (and you might ask your friends) how many of the (alleged) six million jewish victims of the german nazis could, in fact, have passed themselves off as germans, and so avoided the consequences.
      They don’t ALL look like Yoshiyahu Pinto….or Shylock

      Did they declare themselves jewish because of their ‘religiosity’, or because of their race and culture?

      By coincidence I’m just now seeing a protest (ABCTV News -israel) of a lot jews insisting they’ll have no part of a two-state palestine because god gave ‘Moishe’ the whole shebang, to belong to the jews alone for ever.
      EVERY single protester interviewed had the same argument, and NONE of them offered any other justification for the occupation or anything else that’s done to secure palestine for the jews.

      Tell me again that racism isn’t the root of judaism.

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      • I don’t know why this finished up further up the page:-
        on February 14, 2014 at 10:44 said:

        No it’s not the same as “bloody catholics”.
        Catholics are catholics by choice (disregarding for the moment the issue of brainwashing little kids).
        But jews are BORN jews.
        On what other basis can you claim Jesus was a jew?
        (Adam was also the ‘son of god’ according to the gospels, but nobody’s ever claimed he was a jew, have they?)

        So….Why WAS Jesus a jew?

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      • Dabs, you are talking I presume about the Hebrews, and a considerable time ago. I think in Old Testament times life was fairly precarious, and all ethnic groups had a need to band together against others, for survival. The roots of racism were everywhere then, not just with the Jews.

        Jesus showed a better way.

        There were people then (and now), of all ethnicities, who could think outside the box. Did you look into those various branched of Judaism listed? Yes, there are some, like the Zionists, who are very legalistic, and seem to be still living in the O.T. There are others, and many who are Jews in name only, or who only keep the traditional fasts and feasts (like many nominal Christians keep Christmas and Easter) – who live totally in the present day with all its education, understanding, and empathy towards other peoples.

        If others today haven’t reached this ‘enlightenment’, don’t blame certain Jews for not having done so.

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      • “Dabs, you are talking I presume about the Hebrews, and a considerable time ago”.
        No…I’m talking about judaism at any time in any place. The history is the same everywhere.

        If today’s ‘peace-loving’ westernised jew living in StKilda and barracking for Collingwood supports (more, doesn’t, as a human being, actually decry) the crimes against humanity perpetrated by the worst zionists in palestine then they own a share in the atrocity.
        That principle was well-established in the Nuremberg War Crimes Trials and has resulted in prosecutions and executions around the world ever since.

        Except where the jews are concerned. Can’t help wondering why.

        ,,,and can’t help wondering how your resolve to “make a new life somewhere else and eventually, I’d like to think that I would forgive.” would be effected if, while you were being ejected, your kids and grandkids were being mutilated ~ in yopur presence, even ~ by land-claiming gunmen and pilots justified by propagandists citing their DIY god.

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      • I guess then you’re somewhat responsible for the crimes of your father’s countrymen. I don’t think you’ve read the transcripts of the Nuremberg trials. Or if you have, you’ve somehow twisted them in your mid to justify your anti-Semitism. Anyway, enough is enough. No more racist talk please.

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      • Another computer-glitch! bugger!
        But the point is clear: Jews ARE a distinct race, and can ONLY have become so deliberately, with social-engineering policies enforced over thousands of years.

        ie. You CAN pick a jew by his DNA; but you CAN’T pick a catholic, methodist or born-againner (or even an incestuous Collingwood supporter!) by THEIR DNA.

        Indisputably, racism IS the root of judaism.

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      • Since you won’t answer the question, let me re-assert that of course racism is the root of Judaism .
        Judaism could not exist without the inbred structure of racial engineering.
        ‘Racial purity’ has been keynote of judaism since day dot.

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    • ….and of course the other point you make is that if there were no religion/s most of the strife in the world would be avoided.
      On that basis alone ~ and even if there WERE a god ~ the most sensible thing to do would be to declare atheism the law.
      Wouldn’t it?

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      • Dabs,

        You’re not going to like what I think. As far as I am concerned, Israel belongs to the Jews. And yet, if might knocked down my door, threw me out and off my own land, I would hate them with a vengeance…..but I’d try and make a new life somewhere else and eventually, I’d like to think that I would forgive.

        Did you know that Hitler put the word out to annihilate the tiny island of Malta? During World War II, Malta endured an epic two-year siege and suffered more than 3,000 bombing raids. Do the maths! Do you know that my great grandparents (not even 50 years of age, and my great grandmother the most beautiful looking woman I have ever seen) were killed as a result of a rogue German bomber dropping a bomb on their house two weeks after the war was officially ended. Even now I still cry over the injustice of that, so the pain and sense of loss lives on, but hey, that’s life! But I look with awe at my 17 and 18 year old parents, both still children in a lot of respects, who left their families and all they had ever known and hopped on a ship to came to Australia to make a new life because Malta was a pile of rubble, which is the story of many Maltese people, and other nationalities. Life is not fair but you just have to play the hand you are dealt:

        Legal Rights and Title of Sovereignty of the Jewish People to the Land of Israel and Palestine under International Law

        http://www.acpr.org.il/ENGLISH-NATIV/02-issue/grief-2.htm

        Like

      • A telling comment there Mon.—> ” And yet, if might knocked down my door, threw me out and off “MY OWN” land,….”
        I won’t comment on the rest of your post.

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      • Well of course I know that “Did you know that Hitler put the word out to annihilate the tiny island of Malta?”
        …and quite rightly too, from a strategic point of view.
        Malta was the hub of the british war effort in the Mediterranean, and ~indirectly ~ held the (potential) key to victory for either side.
        (access to the vast Caucasus oilfields)

        If you accept the legitimacy of the war (which, as an anarchist I don’t) then you have to accept the legitimacy of the bombing of Malta…and Hamburg (the first air-raid of WWII), Warsaw, Dresden, London, Mannheim, etc….. all the way up to Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
        The US and the british decided as early as the 1920s that if there was another war official policy would be to bomb cities full of civilians into submission in order to (1) interdict military production and (2) break the morale of the troops at the fronts.

        Why some pilot dropped bombs after the ‘cessation of hostilities’ is anybody’s guess. But the reason may have been quite legitimate……
        Maybe (given the destruction and dislocation) word hadn’t yet got through?
        ………or maybe because god told him to. 😦

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      • Quite right, Mon:- “You’re not going to like what I think. As far as I am concerned, Israel belongs to the Jews.”

        But, do tell, WHY do you say israel belongs to the jews??

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      • The Quran Proves that the Land of Israel Belongs to the Jewish People:

        The Koran and the Jews
        By Jamie Glazov—FrontPageMagazine.com—June 3, 2004

        Frontpage Interview’s guest today is Prof. Khaleel Mohammed, Assistant Professor at the Department of Religious Studies at San Diego State University.

        FP: Prof. Mohammed welcome to Frontpage Interview.

        Mohammed: You do me a great honor. Thank you for giving me this opportunity to introduce my views to your readers. As you know, I am interested in a moderate Islam, one that is inclusive and is concerned about all human rights. My mission is to help reclaim the beauty that once was practiced in Islam, a message not currently in fashion amongst more traditional or fundamentalist Muslims.

        FP: You are yourself a Muslim and yet, quite unconventionally amongst Islamic clerics and scholars, you teach that the Koran says Israel belongs to the Jews. Can you educate us on this Islamic teaching?

        Mohammed: The Qur’an adumbrates several principles that hover around a common theme: God does not love injustice and will assist those who are wrongly treated. And it focuses so much on this that the person most mentioned in the Qur’an is Moses — who is presented as God’s revolutionary, and who leads a people despised and tormented for no other reason than that they worshipped God, out of the land of bondage to the Promised Holy Land.
        The Qur’an in Chapter 5: 20-21 states quite clearly: Moses said to his people:

        O my people! Remember the bounty of God upon you when He bestowed prophets upon you, and made you kings and gave you that which had not been given to anyone before you amongst the nations. O my people! Enter the Holy Land which God has written for you, and do not turn tail, otherwise you will be losers.”

        The Quran goes on to say why the Israelites were not allowed to enter the land for forty years…but the thrust of my analysis is where Moses says that the Holy Land is that which God has “written” for the Israelites.

        In both Jewish and Islamic understandings of the term “written”, there is the meaning of finality, decisiveness and immutability. And so we have the Written Torah (unchangeable) and the Oral Torah (which represents change to suit times). And in the Qur’an we have “Written upon you is the fast”–to show that this is something that is decreed, and which none can change. So the simple fact is then, from a faith-based point of view: If God has “written” Israel for the people of Moses, who can change this?

        The Qur’an refers to the exiles, but leaves it open for return…saying to the Jews that if they keep their promise to God, then God will keep the divine promise to them.

        WE may argue that the present state of Israel was not created in the most peaceful means, and that many were displaced–for me, this is not the issue.

        The issue is that when the Muslims entered that land in the seventh century, they were well aware of its rightful owners, and when they failed to act according to divine mandate (at least as perceived by followers of all Abrahamic faiths), they aided and abetted in a crime. And the present situation shows the fruits of that action–wherein innocent Palestinians and Israelis are being killed on a daily basis.

        I also draw your attention to the fact that the medieval exegetes of Qur’an–without any exception known to me–recognized Israel as belonging to the Jews, their birthright given to them. Indeed, two of Islam’s most famous exegetes explained “written” from Quran 5:21 thus: Ibn Kathir (d. 774/1373) said:

        “That which God has written for you” i.e. That which God has promised to you by the words of your father Israel that it is the inheritance of those among you who believe. Muhammad al-Shawkani (d. 1250/1834) interprets Kataba to mean “That which God has allotted and predestined for you in His primordial knowledge, deeming it as a place of residence for you” (1992, 2:41).

        The idea that Israel does not belong to the Jews is a modern one, probably based on the Mideast rejection of European colonialism etc, but certainly not having anything to do with the Qur’an. The unfortunate fact is that most Muslims do NOT read the Qur’an and interpret it on the basis of its own words; rather they let imams and preachers do that for them.

        FP: You say that when the Muslims entered the sacred land in the seventh century, “They aided and abetted in a crime” Can you expand on this a bit? How honest is contemporary Islam with this fact?

        Mohammed: How did the Jews lose their right to live in the Holy Land? All reliable reports show that it was by the looting and burning that followed from 70-135 C.E. When the Muslims entered the place in 638, liberating it from the Byzantines, they knew full well to whom it rightfully belonged.”

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      • And from a Biblical standpoint:

        I support Israel because all other nations were created by an act of men, but Israel was created by an act of God! The Royal Land Grant that was given to Abraham and his seed through Isaac and Jacob with an everlasting and unconditional covenant. (Genesis 12:1-3, 13:14-18, 15:1-21, 17:4-8, 22:15-18, 26:1-5 and Psalm 89:28-37.)

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      • And would you believe I just received this now? So…..I can’t help it, it’s such a wonderful story that I have to include it here. She’s the woman in her 90’s whose story I put on the blog not long ago about winning ICEJ’s recent beauty pagent, but this is the first time they have said anything about the real circumstances that led her to ICEJ’s Home for Holocaust Survivors :

        http://int.icej.org/news/special-reports/survivor-profile-shoshanna-alon?

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      • Thanks, Mon, for the confirmation that the existence of judaism depends upon race (“Abraham’s seed”:-

        The Royal Land Grant that was given to Abraham and his seed through Isaac and Jacob with an everlasting and unconditional covenant. (Genesis 12:1-3, 13:14-18, 15:1-21, 17:4-8, 22:15-18, 26:1-5 and Psalm 89:28-37.)

        The cheque’s in the mail! 🙂

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    • The theme of Isaiah is jubilation, a song of celebration at the imminent end of the Babylonian Captivity. It is in this setting that we find the Song of the Servant, chapter fifty-three. (In fact, chapter 53 is actually the fourth of a quartet of “servant songs”. The others are 42:1-9, 49:1-6 and 50:4-9). Who, then, was this servant of whom deutero-Isaiah speaks? It is evident that the word is used in two different ways. First, it is used by deutero-Isaiah to apply to himself, as the servant of God (49:5). The word is used overwhelmingly, however, by the author to refer to the nation Israel itself.
      Isaiah 41:8-9 But thou, Israel, art my servant, Jacob whom I have chosen, the seed of Abraham my friend. Thou whom I have taken from the ends of the earth, and called thee from the chief men thereof, and said unto thee, Thou art my servant; I have chosen thee, and not cast thee away.
      Isaiah 44:1 Yet now hear, O Jacob my servant; and Israel, whom I have chosen…Thus saith the Lord that made thee, and formed thee from the womb, which will help thee; Fear not, O Jacob, my servant…
      Isaiah 44:21 Remember these, O Jacob and Israel; for thou art my servant: I have formed thee; thou art my servant: O Israel, thou shalt not be forgotten of me.
      Isaiah 49:3 …Thou art my servant, O Israel, in whom I will be glorified.
      It should be abundantly clear, then, that the servant is the nation Israel. When we combine these two facts, the fact that the theme of second Isaiah is the restoration of Israel after Exile, and the fact that the servant is the nation Israel itself, we then find that the meaning of the Song of the Servant, in chapter 53, becomes clear.
      http://www.miracles-of-jesus-christ.com/suffering_servant.htm

      Seems Jesus was emulating this, taking the role on himself.

      Like

      • Count how many times is repeated “Thou art my servant”. It’s time for this to sink in with some Jews, I think.

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      • With that sort of incisive intelligent response you’ll no doubt be in line for a Nobel Prize.

        But are you ever going to answer a reasonable question,
        ….or behave like some others ~ whom you castigate for not doing so?

        Like

    • retry:-
      “To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize.”- Voltaire

      When you run out of grandma-isms
      When you have no rational argument to make
      When “”Letting a hundred flowers blossom and a hundred schools of thought contend” becomes an embarrassment,
      When you can’t come up with a reasonable response to a reasonable question,
      And when the truth becomes ‘inconvenient’,
      ….Then crawl further into ‘The Box’ of Bigotry and slam shut the barricade of censorship.

      How DO you know, as you’ve so often proclaimed, Jesus was a jew?

      ….and as for the Nuremberg trials, anybody that’s taken even half an interest will know that the single most binding, and universally-accepted principle established by the process is that

      ‘I WAS JUST OBEYING ORDERS’ is NEVER an excuse for mass-murder or other crimes against humanity.
      (and I suspect ‘Jesus’ would support that view).

      Whether those orders come from your Grandma, from the State or from God.

      That the jews are a deliberately-created ‘race’ is an article of pride among the “Chosen People”. THEY don’t deny it.
      That it’s a cold-blooded, self-serving and murderous race is nowhere better confirmed than in its own history.

      However, let’s not …..er, ‘think’ about that, hey?

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      • I think we all agree with you Bryan. Bigots are most often the loudest people on the block.. They are the equivalent of the old woman who mutters at you when you walk past her house every morning, or the racist distant cousin who bails you up at family events to tell you about ‘queue jumpers’ and how the moon landing never really happened.
        Write a considered response to this racism stuff and some bonehead will rile up to screech at you in caps letters, “WHATEVER HAPPENED TO FREEDOM OF SPEECH?!?!?” My dear, you are witnessing it in action.

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      • Correct Maz.. I believe bullies, bigots, trolling, and hate speech of any kind must be challenged. At some level, these people want to get a rise out of others, it’s entertainment to them, but the real issue is deeper than that. Bullies and bigots want to silence. They want to take control over others. By “not feeding the trolls,” we give in to being silenced. We may not always be able to stand up and fight back, sometimes we must resort to simply ignoring the hate and we may rarely change a bullies mind, but, when we are able to, we must stand up and refuse to be silenced. No doubt you and I will cop a serve from the bigot. They can’t help themselves. . It’s textbook psychology.

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      • Wrong again…. “Bigotry is demeaning an entire race.”

        Bigot:- A prejudiced person who is intolerant of any opinions differing from his own
        partisan
        dogmatist
        zealot
        Zealot:- A member of an ancient Jewish sect in Judea in the first century

        And I see you’ve turned the local dimwits out to support your indefensibly stubborn stand. If they were halfway literate they could look up the FACTS you’ve refused to post regarding the racially-distinctive DNA of jews, as published BY jews in authoritative journals. Proven information isn’t ‘prejudice’ just because you don’t like it.

        And as for this little strawman diversion:- “There are also laws against it”, I make the point that truth/facts are ALWAYS a conclusive defence against (even PC) accusations.

        It’s a very much more hopeless task to try to convince dogma-motivated godbotherers who reject facts with diversions like “Ho hum” and “Get some air”. I was walking the neighbour’s dogs from 4 to 5 am today, and then took mine out for a 5km walk, as I do almost every day. What were you breathing at the time?

        Certainly not the oxygen of intellectual honesty.

        http://forward.com/articles/155742/jews-are-a-race-genes-reveal/?p=all
        http://www.huffingtonpost.com/harry-ostrer/observing-my-jewish-legacy-in-my_b_1601273.html

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      • I have no argument that Judaism is a race. My argument is that you condemn an entire race with bigoted and racist statements that ARE clearly silly and against the law.

        Ok let’s look at the definitions.
        Bigotry: intolerance towards those who hold different opinions from oneself.

        Yep.

        Bigot: One who is strongly partial to one’s own group, religion, race, or politics and is intolerant of those who differ.

        racist – a person with a prejudiced belief that one race is superior or inferior to others

        And tell me it’s not bigoted and racist to describe an entire race as cold-blooded, self-serving and murderous? That’s both bigoted and racist.

        AND

        And as for this little strawman diversion:- “There are also laws against it”, I make the point that truth/facts are ALWAYS a conclusive defence against (even PC) accusations.

        Well no. That’s no what the law says at all. You really have no idea. Bush lawyers are a dangerous breed mate.

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      • Bwahahahaha..I told you Maz that the bloke would have a go at us…Textbook stuff…The intellectually-challenged bigot calls us dimwits!!!!!!…That’s makes my day. Absolutely brilliant. I’m off to celebrate with my mates. Can’t wait to tell them.

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      • Sorry Dabbles. Bryan is right. In slander and defamation cases, truth, even if it is indeed truth, is no defence. I am a working lawyer in that field and know this to be fact.. .

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      • “Bwahahahaha..I told you Maz that the bloke would have a go at us…Textbook stuff…The intellectually-challenged bigot calls us dimwits!!!!!!…That’s makes my day. Absolutely brilliant. I’m off to celebrate with my mates. Can’t wait to tell them.”

        Be sure to say hi to davinci, the Grand Poobah, at the Loyal Order of the Water Buffaloes, Lodge Number 26 meeting for me tonight, Hassan. I’m sure you make a fetching couple. 😉

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      • Perhaps you’ve got the wrong glasses on?
        Juxtaposing these two unrelated comments is a gross non sequitur.—–>

        “racist – a person with a prejudiced belief that one race is superior or inferior to others

        And tell me it’s not bigoted and racist to describe an entire race as cold-blooded, self-serving and murderous? That’s both bigoted and racist.”

        Moreover, I make ~ and have made ~ NO assertion as to whether one race is superior or inferior to another race.

        All I’ve done is to insist, in the face of extreme bigotry, that (a) the jews are in fact a distinctly genetic ‘race’ (ie ‘racially pure’), and can ONLY have become that via fairly strict inbreeding over a long period of time, and

        (b) ….. that jewish race, as a racial pursuit, has committed untold treacheries and atrocities, which are recorded in it’s own history and is not denied but, rather, justified (generally as ):- god told us to do it.

        I have no problem in agreeing that my comments regarding race are ‘racist’. ANY discussion about ANY race must by definition be ‘racist’.
        What else CAN it be??

        But the claim that those comments are “bigoted” is a nonsense.
        I’m more than willing to change my views if you can adduce facts which convincingly contradict those views.

        A bigot would never even consider changing his views. As a religious dogmatist and a politically-correct defender of judaism you should understand that.

        Would YOU change your views on these issues, regardless of what a bucketful of facts dictated?

        I thought not.
        Bigotry is as bigotry does.

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      • I repeat – to describe an entire race as cold-blooded, self-serving and murderous is both bigoted and racist.

        Racial vilification is the term in the legislation of Australia that refers to a public act that encourages or incites others to hate people because of their race, nationality, country of origin, colour or ethnic origin.

        The Racial Discrimination Act makes it unlawful to insult, humiliate, offend or intimidate another person or group in public on the basis of their race. Specifically, the Act states:

        It is unlawful for a person to do an act, otherwise than in private, if:
        (a) the act is reasonably likely in all the circumstances to offend, insult, humiliate or intimidate another person or group of people, and
        (b) the act is done because of the race, colour or national or ethnic origin of the other person or some or all of the people in the group.

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  6. Crap! ~ and a good example of how bigots tend to latch on to any nonsense which appears to support their claim.
    Perhaps ‘Kevin’ would care to post the name/contact details of his law firm? It’s principals may be interested to hear he’s not familiar with the nationally-adopted ‘Defamation Laws’, as amended up to the end of 2013. THAT legislation offers half a dozen defences against defamation, including ‘opinion’, ‘public record’, and ~ most particularly:-

    DEFAMATION ACT 2005 – SECT 25
    Defence of justification
    25 Defence of justification
    It is a defence to the publication of defamatory matter if the defendant proves that the defamatory imputations carried by the matter of which the plaintiff complains are substantially true.

    The history of judaism, as recorded BY judaism, ~ and more specifically ‘israel’ since 1948 ~ provide ample evidence that my claims are “substantially true”.
    (and in fact are NOT denied by judaism/israel. Instead they’re ‘justified’ on the basis that god gave them the land and everything in it forever.)

    …..moreover, a ‘race’ cannot be identified as a plaintiff in any defamation proceedings; hence there can be NO defamation against ‘judaism’.
    Neither can judaism or israel show ‘damage’ or loss (‘economic’ or reputational) from my comments ~ hence there’s no basis for launching a defamation case anyway.

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    • On 1 January 2002, Victoria put into effect its Racial and Religious Tolerance Act 2001 which makes religious vilification as well as racial vilification unlawful. Section 8(1) of the Act states:
      A person must not, on the ground of the religious belief or activity of another person or class of persons, engage in conduct that incites hatred against, serious contempt for, or revulsion or severe ridicule of, that other person or class of persons. Note: “engage in conduct” includes use of the internet or e-mail to publish or transmit statements or other material.

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  7. “Well no. That’s noT what the law says at all.”

    Well no….
    That’s exactly what the law says, as cited above.

    …. and
    Yep!….”Bush lawyers are a dangerous breed mate.”
    ….especially when they’re right ~ and can prove it.

    Dunno how many cases you’ve defended in court, but in the day I defended myself often (with a fair percentage of wins) including two serious Supreme Court trials and one appearance before the Appeals Court, all three of which I won . (one with a little support from a very fair-minded and assertive Mr Justice Lush…..one man who was truly worthy of the title ‘Your Honour’.)

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    • No, a little knowledge can deceive……Were you up on charges of slander or defamation or racial vilification? I doubt it… It’s a different realm from the criminal charges you faced. I think the real lawyer knows a bit more about that subject that you do Dabs. You can rant on in ignorance as much as you like but the fact is that truth – or opinion – is NO defence in slander and defamation and racial vilification cases.

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      • Sorry: read again the cut-and-paste quote from the ‘DEFAMATION ACT 2005 – SECT 25’ I provided above. The FYI read up on Sections 24 through 29, and you’ll see there are all sorts of legal defences against defamation/slander torts.

        You’re not only changing horses in mid-stream, but trying to lump separate pieces of legislation together under one banner. —–>

        I remind you:-
        Kevin:
        Sorry Dabbles. Bryan is right. In SLANDER and DEFAMATION cases, truth, even if it is indeed truth, is no defence. I am a working lawyer in that field and know this to be fact.. .

        bryanpattersonfaithworks on February 15, 2014 at 21:33 said:
        “Thanks Kevin”

        ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,What’s any of that got to do with the Racial Vilification Act?
        Further, my experience in criminal law ( also LGA and other laws) have made it clear that for any law there are loopholes ~ and from what little I know of the Racial Vilification laws I can think of several such off the top of my head. Expecting guests, but will have a look when time permits.
        ….and if the federal govt doesn’t repeal them, as promised, in the meantime (hopefully). Do you realise that absurd leftie invention protects paedophiles or groups of paedophiles (or Neo-Nazis, etc,) from ‘vilification’??

        “Section 8(1) of the Act states:
        A person must not, on the ground of the religious belief OR ACTIVITY of another person or class of persons, engage in conduct that incites hatred against, serious contempt for, or revulsion or severe ridicule of, that other person or class of persons. Note: “engage in conduct” includes use of the internet or e-mail to publish or transmit statements or other material.”

        It would also outlaw anyone who called the Westboro congregation
        (and I quote) “arseholes”, as somebody did here recently.
        (assuming the ‘arseholes’ took offence. tsk tsk tsk

        But a vagrant thought occurs, to keep you amused in the meantime:-
        Judaism generally ~ but most blatantly in occupied palestine ~ absolutely shatters every provision of the (aust) ‘RACIAL DISCRIMINATION ACT 1975 ‘
        Perhaps you could ask Kevin if saying so publicly would breach the Racial Vilification laws.

        Incidentally, Andrew Bolt wasn’t convicted because of what he said but because ~ as the judge saw it ~ of the WAY in which he said it.

        I’LL…..BE…..BACK.
        ( Douglas MacArthur )

        Like

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