Reasoning to atheism

lewis

C.S Lewis is best known for his books, The Chronicles of Narnia. He also wrote 47 works of non-fiction, 11 of fiction and four poetry collections.

He also said:

“Those who reject Christianity will not be moved by Christ’s statement that poverty is blessed. But here a rather remarkable fact comes to my aid. Those who would most scornfully repudiate Christianity as a mere ‘opiate of the people’ have contempt for the rich, that is, for all mankind except the poor. They regard the poor as the only people worth preserving from ‘liquidation’, and place in them the only hope for the human race. But this is not compatible with a belief that the effects of poverty on those who suffer it are wholly evil; it even implies that they are good. The Marxist thus finds himself in real agreement with the Christian in those two beliefs which Christianity paradoxically demands – that poverty is blessed and yet ought to be removed.”

“I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else.”

“Christianity, if false, is of no importance, and if true, of infinite importance. The only thing it cannot be is moderately important.”

http://defythenarrative.com/2013/09/27/c-s-lewis-was-a-junkie-or-something/

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24 thoughts on “Reasoning to atheism

  1. I do wish you’d stop citing this fool, Bryan; he embarrasses anybody WITH a brain, and does you (or your case) no credit.
    In the above ‘argument’ he starts off with the FALSE premise that his ‘ability to think’ came first and that therefore everything else must be bent to accommodate that.
    It’s bullshit!
    It’s the same argument that a turd floating down the sewer would make in explaining the reason for the existence of bread and meat.

    ….and on the more ‘esoteric’ level he tries to inject as a blatant distraction the first most obvious question must be:
    How does he KNOW he is, in fact, ‘thinking’.

    I could dismantle every single comment of his you’ve ever quoted, but will end with one you HAVEN’T quoted ~ but which I posted a few days ago, insisting that having an open mind is anathema, and that those who do open their minds should at least keep their mouths shut.
    I’ll trawl back and find it if you insist. (It was right above a quote from
    Lazarus Long)
    Lewis has no qualifications on which to base his pontifications (UNLIKE RICHARD DAWKINS!!); he’s a writer of fairy tales, and it shows; if he was prattling on on any other subject you wouldn’t give him a moment’s thought.

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    • Have to agree, Dabs, and I’m not an atheist.

      “Those who would most scornfully repudiate Christianity as a mere ‘opiate of the people’ have contempt for the rich, that is, for all mankind except the poor. They regard the poor as the only people worth preserving from ‘liquidation’, and place in them the only hope for the human race.”
      How can he say that!?

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  2. I’ve just lost half a page of reasoned argument to cyberspace, and don’t have the time to reprose it.
    Salient points were:-

    Lewis’ “rather remarkable fact” :- “Those who would most scornfully repudiate Christianity as a mere ‘opiate of the people’ have contempt for the rich”
    ISN’T a fact at all ~ and I’m amazed that any trained journalist would let such an obvious and unchecked bit of nonsense go through to the Editor.
    You KNOW that’s not my stance.
    Nor that of Bill Gates, George Soros, Warren Buffet, etc. ~ all of which (non-believers) have the greatest respect for riches: so much so that they regularly donate many BILLIONS of dollars in trying to alleviate poverty.
    And even Karl Marx, far from having “contempt” for riches, in fact envied the rich ~ and his stated ambition was to spread the wealth.
    His ‘religion is the opiate of the masses’ was simply his description of the greatest hurdle to be overcome in achieving that ambition.

    Unlike, of course, Jesus, who not only declared poverty ‘blessed’, and demanded the rich should divest themselves of wealth and join the ranks of the poor and diseased, but actually determined that poverty should always exist. (Matt. 26:11, elsewhere).
    Unlike Junkies for Jesus! addicted to a (opium) pipe-dream, wealthier people are more willing and able to exercise options NOT to be a Jesus freak, and are therefore a threat to the
    hegemony of of the Pusher.

    …..and even BillyBob is intelligent enough to know that one can’t follow a trail of “arguments” ~trustworty or otherwise ~ in order to arrive at ‘atheism’, as Lewis claims. Atheism is the default setting for the entire universe: any ‘argument’ can only be away from an atheist position.

    About the only thing Lewis got right is the assertion that:- “…nobody designed my brain for the purpose of thinking.”

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    • An hostility against those which doubt the being of God pretty much joins the intolerance this planet suffers so much from.

      Some which dispute the being of God do so from their trust in the sciences, and though science, like religion, often poses its opinions as if authoritative facts, those which aspire to a loyalty to Truth cannot discount sciences fair right to challenge the world’s religions… there are so many obvious negatives in those faiths !

      Its also boldly dishonest, and rather arrogant, to forcingly assert ones beliefs when those things are infact beliefs, not knowledge. This does not say ones decision to believe in God is mistaken, but that belief inherently involves a degree of doubt, and its wrong to charge bull-headly against those which do doubt.

      The defence of the presence of God in life needs a calm Heart and clear mind… honesty and understanding… kindness and tolerance.

      It also greatly helps if one has some legitimate experiences of our mysterious God.

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      • Well said.
        On the other hand, an hostility against ~ and intolerance of ~ the determined dissemination of stupidity is entirely justified (even demanded) in anybody, regardless of what their ‘blief’ is.

        Unfortunately, as the man said, There’s no wowser like a reformed drunk.

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    • It stands to ….er, ‘reason’, given his 25-watt IQ.
      Pity he didn’t “end his life” before he contaminated so many gullible twits…like those depicted in the links above, who use many of his ‘arguments’.

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  3. Well after reading that tripe I certainly don’t trust the thought process of CS Lewis nor can I imagine why he should. I don’t know which is worse the inane circular reasoning or the arrogance that he considers his thoughts to be divine in origin.

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  4. The Protestant religion is a puzzleing construct, for though protestants profess belief in and followship/fellowship with Jesus, and they deem Jesus was the very son of God and soby being purely good and perfectly righteous ( allways doing what right/never doing anything wrong ) , protestants also follow after the mortal, and sothen imperfect, Paul/Saul, whom insists Jesus ( and God) were wrong and he (Paul) knows better than they do !

    Paul claims humankind do NOT need serve the laws and sacrifices Jesus himself declared to be our Gods will, which he Himself DID follow and practice, and Jesus Himself teaches us we also need practice.

    ( Paul only has his own claims Jesus spoke to him and authorized Paul in his new law, overruling Jesus’s and God’s previous laws.)

    Its understood, it was Jesus’s great virtue which sanctified His resurrection from crucifiction, and it was His 3 days in death which sanctified and authorized and empowered Jesus to forgive the offences for our entire human race.

    If now Jesus was NOT purely good and perfectly righteous as Paul’s new law, of only belief is needed, can only mean, what is it followers of Paul actually believe in ?

    Jesus now was not the virtue nor righteousness of God, but a corrupt, sothen mortal man, and how is He to now forgive ones offences ?

    Without the Love from God where is offence, and without love and offence where is forgiveness, and without love and offence and forgiveness where is the justice, even need, of the resurrection from death ?

    Doesn’t the life and teaches and works of Jesus collapse into corruption when His Laws and Cross are discounted as unnecessary and mistaken, wrong teachings ?

    If resurrection is needed as death exists and death exists as offence exists, yet there is no law/duty for love/against offence, why was Jesus even given to be born in the first place !

    Perhaps you protestants should put more effort into the Truth than insincere, self-serving praise and ceremonies for a person you infact don’t believe in … much less time spent on believing and much more on healthy, rational understanding (knowledge).

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    • Gregory, Paul certainly was responsible for changing Christian beliefs. Whether this was the will of God I do not know, but I cannot understand why you think only Protestants take note of Paul and even distort his teaching.

      Your attitude seems opposite to what you called for in your first post on this subject – tolerance and clear thinking.

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    • Paul claims humankind do NOT need serve the laws and sacrifices Jesus himself declared to be our Gods will, which he Himself DID follow and practice, and Jesus Himself teaches us we also need practice.

      When did jesus sacrifice anything? Please provide proof of any animal (oxen, doves, sheep) which Jesus would have had to sacrifice on his own behalf.
      Come on provide the ancient documents to support your claims! Bet you can’t! And if you can’t why should we trust anything you have to say about Christianity?

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  5. What do protestants and atheists have in common… both act to avoid their responsibility to others, mostly those sacrifices such a responsibility requires.

    Protestants reject their duty to the laws Jesus taught to avoid His cross, and atheists wont accept being enslaved to serving others. Protestants effectively reject Jesus and atheists reject God altogether… not a far difference I think.

    Protestants and atheists cannot be reasoned with as both are passionately determined to live their own lives and negate their responsibilities, and sacrifices, for others.

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      • Bryan ; I’m not surprised you decide my views here ‘ make no sense ‘ ; I’ve yet to meet one protestant who is aware of the conflicts between Martin Luther’s alliance with Saul/Paul from what Jesus Himself (allegedly… I don’t entirely trust any of the authors of the various books of the Bible ) teaches and COMMANDS in the Gospels.

        For protestants to choose to not believe in their need to sincerely and meaningfully follow the laws Jesus taught and take-up his cross in favour of their choice to believe their redemption from their offences and neglects needs only a professed belief in Jesus is hardly a distorted misunderstanding.

        True, some protestants indeed take-up a meaningful concern for others lives and needs and circumstances and feelings, etc, and do infact make significant sacrifices in so doing, yet many do not. Many take-up Martin Luther’s religion for what they get for themselves doing so ; some are born into a protestant family and have been indocrinated into it ; the protestant religion OVERFLOWS with (conflicting) individual interpretations and faiths and all CANNOT be true nor right, etc.

        I’ve consistantly stated my position sincere believers in Jesus WILL take-up Love and Righteousness and Sacrifice right from my start here. I’ve cited many priviledged experiences of the Holy, Loving mystical presence involved in this life which I gained from my sincere followhip with Jesus by the sacrifices and commitments I made, and still do. How am I wrong ?

        St. John 14:21 ‘ They that hath my commandments and keepeth them, they it is that loveth me, …and I will love them, and I will manifest myself to them ‘

        Most of the christian world-cultures peoples luxuriate in wealth and possessions and pleasures.

        AND, there’s volumes more criticisms to be made, but why… protestants have decided to choose they’re NOT bonded to the duty to the laws Jesus taught… they believe they cannot gain redemption/salvation by serving those laws and are assured forgiveness when NOT serving those laws, effectively making those laws entirely WORTHLESS !

        Oh well.

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  6. It’s vitally important protestants are offered a hand of help even though most will deny they need it.

    The protestant religion derives from their alliance with and followship of the person Saul/Paul, and his views/opinions, and their disconnect from Jesus.

    Prospective protestants, whether young children in a protestant family or mature adults, new to christianity, are given Paul’s arguement ones belief in Jesus is counted as righeousness and in that alone is sufficient for their salvation. This point then becomes the premise for ones if-then deductive reasoning, and the core idea one then searches their new testament scriptures for for more passages which support that position.

    (The nature of if-then deductive reasoning is if the premise is true, then the conclusion is true, but if the premise is false, the conclusion is also false ( a delusion is formed). Furthermore, if a false premise’s conclusion is used to establish a 2nd new premise, a complex delusion is formed. )

    Because the new testament has also been translated and interpreted by devout protestants, there’s a multitude of other passages which appear to support Paul’s new faith/law ( which distinctly differs from and directly contradicts Jesus’s laws ). As Jesus also requires one to believe in him for such as his healings, etc, it would appear the idea belief is the basis for ones forgiveness and salvation is strengthened. However, rationally healthy-minded readers can see there are contradictions between life after the earth by loving and righteous living versus merely believing.

    For determined protestants, however, they won’t allow those meanings of those passages in which Jesus clearly states righteousness and sacrifice are necessary for ones life after death/the earth. THIS is what seriously adversely alters their mind’s ability to grasp the facts of reality which don’t agree with and don’t serve their beliefs… a unique type of psychosis.

    FEAR of not gaining salvation, of eternal purgatory, of the burdens and losses of righteousness and sacrifice, among other issues, DRIVES and FORCES protestants to reject and deny and betray all Truths and meanings which threaten their salvation.

    If one has the will to reclaim their mental and living health, they need determine to courageously fight down that FEAR and loyally serve TRUTH and its meanings.

    For help strengthening your followship of Jesus, visit my blog…
    http://gjpaul.wordpress.com/ .. and read my post ” Some evidences of Soul ” ,
    then ” Alien species at work here ” ( the lower part… my refute of aliens ) ,
    then finally ” WakeUp Number 37 ” .

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  7. Our brains are incredibly fallible, quite often we can’t trust our thinking to be true. We make mistakes, we forget, we come to erroneous conclusions. CS Lewis might have been onto something.

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